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Chat No. 162: 

THE CURRENT SITUATION IN VENEZUELA III 

THE INTERNATIONAL CONTEXT: UNO, USA, EUROPE, IRAQ. 

GENERAL DISCUSSION. 


JUTTA (Mérida, Venezuela),
IRIS (Freiburg, Germany),
CARL (Teaneck, USA),
SCOTT (Florida, USA),
JÜRGEN (Mérida, Venezuela,
FRANZ (Mérida, Venezuela).

 

FEBRUARY 13,  2003. 

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Getting together


 Entering the Chat .....  

jutta_schmitt2002: Hello everybody.
juttafranz: Hi! Folks!!
carlzim: Hi, Franz, Jutta, Scott.
juttafranz: Sorry for the delay, we had an urgent discussion.
jutta_schmitt2002: The four Musketeers ..... Hello Carl, Scott and Franz.
juttafranz: Anyhow, continuing the previous discussion on Venezuela and the world situation,
 any comments, questions or queries?
jutta_schmitt2002: Iris is here with us in Mérida, and won´t be able to connect from her
own computer. She sends her greetings. I guess Stella won't participate. She's busily writing
her thesis.
carlzim: In Franz, there were FOUR grenadiers (LOL)
juttafranz: Iris is here, but we have no extra computer.
juttafranz: Jutta you could commence.

jutta_schmitt2002: Scott and Carl, what is the latest from "The Empire"?
carlzim: Give our regards to Iris.
jutta_schmitt2002: Thanks, Carl.
juttafranz: I will!
juttafranz: She returns the best regards!

carlzim: Jutta, we're waiting for a terrorist attack this weekend.
carlzim: And in Venezuela?
juttafranz: Iris is sitting next to Jutta reading also.
juttafranz: Thus Jutta will intermediate her brilliant views.
nonpositivism: I will be back soon.....
juttafranz: OK, Scott.
jutta_schmitt2002: Can you precise this information a little? I´ve been out of touch with
the latest "information" as spread by the international news media. --- We watched a
Video Documentation about the Venezuelan Events of past April and came to the
conclusion, that "information" is a complete disaster. - But, please elaborate, Carl.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl, last thing I´ve been aware of with regard to what the
psychowarfare propaganda machine calls "terrorist threats" is the rising of the
multi-coloured warning levels. Other than that, what "concretely" is to be expected?

juttafranz: Why does Bin Laden give Powell the strategic information that he needs
to connect Iraq and Al Qaeda, at the right place, at the right time. Just like the Columbia
exploded at the most appropriate moment.
nonpositivism: Ok, back online.........How is everybody today?
carlzim: Jutta, the media is advising the public how to cope with chemical, biological
& radiological attacks
.
carlzim: Yep, Franz.
jutta_schmitt2002: On Venezuela: It seems there is another coup in the making, Carl.
This time an exclusively military one, a "surgical operation" intended to take Chávez
out and get into control right away, suppressing any support for Chávez and encouraging
support of the newly installed military leaders. This operation is supposed to be directed
from abroad, with the help of central military figures in the Venezuelan Army. Thus, the
story of the coups here is far from over.
juttafranz: Scott, will we soon see World War III with Germany, Belgium and France
against the USA?
nonpositivism: Jutta, what sources are giving u this information about the "next coup"
 in Venezuela? Please advise us here.
nonpositivism: Franz, what do you think?
nonpositivism: I do think that Helen Caldicott, Bob Byrd and others are profoundly right
and admirable in pointing out the pitfalls, this logical "insanity" at the heart of the
War-mongering.
nonpositivism: Hello, Jurgen!
juttafranz: Or are the "friends" just practising some shadow-boxing, to get fit for the
Mideast War, that began already?

nonpositivism: Of course, the insanity depends on ur point of view, doesn't it?:>
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl: On what exactly are the "terrorist warnings" based, Carl. - Scott,
a political analyst from a newspaper called "Quinto Día", in his weekly column, draws this
 scenario. This is an analyst who pretty much accurately "predicted", based on his sources
of information, past April´s coup d´état as well as the december "general strike", the core
asset of which was the oil industry. Visit
http://www.quintodia.com .
nonpositivism: OK, JSP beta!
jutta_schmitt2002: Nope. JS the Original.
jutta_schmitt2002: (Don´t get confused now. ;) )
jurgen784: Hello! nonpositivissm: ¿What’s the latest with regard to the Alert Levels in
the USA?

juttafranz: Juergen, what next in Venezuela?
jutta_schmitt2002: Hello Jürgen! Glad you made it! What news do you have for us today?
nonpositivism: Jurgen, it's a "joke". the USA public is totally confused.
nonpositivism: No one knows how to treat these alerts.
nonpositivism: I don't watch television so I'm not caught up in the madness.

jutta_schmitt2002: Scott, can you please clarify, for all of us non-Americans, who/what
established the Alert Levels and who/what determines, based on which criteria, their value?
nonpositivism: our NeoNazi Tom Ridge and his Homeland Defense People established a
color code, priority levels of awareness.
carlzim: Agreed, Scott! These are based on so-called intelligence reports and a new phony
Bin Laden audio tape.

nonpositivism: What are we supposed to be today, Carl? Orange? Pink? or Polka-dot?
jutta_schmitt2002: And: what is the population, what are local and regional authorities
supposed to do in case of high alert levels?
nonpositivism: Jutta. They generally do a little more surveillance, tighten security in some
public places. Without very specific threat, it's very difficult to defend and prepare.
jutta_schmitt2002: What about other nations establishing alert levels with regard to a
heightened threat of preemptive-agressive first strike "defense attacks" coming from the
USA? I think they would have to colour the whole planet in red.
carlzim: After chat, visit: http://channels.netscape.com/ns/news/package.jsp?name=
ews/terror/prepare

nonpositivism: The UK knew what the IRA was up to, most of the time. The Israelis
have very good specific intelligence.

juttafranz: Carl, it is very exciting to live in America these days. We don´t need classical
pan et cirsenses anymore, just an eternal "Alert Cup".
nonpositivism: But with this kind of intelligence the USA is not very good yet. We're
adequate, but uneven.
carlzim: We got NOTHING! (Al Capane)
juttafranz: Scott, but I would not call that intelligence.
juttafranz: It sounds more like a Central Deficiency Agency.

jutta_schmitt2002: Part of the psychological warfare imposed upon the American
population, Franz. With a given, daily dose of fear, just carefully finetuned to oscillate
between constant fear and panic, the still doubtful may be convinced in the end it is a
good thing to erradicate terrorism.
carlzim: We need to understand how our enemies think. For terrorism 101, read the
Al Qaeda manual after chat: http://www.disastercenter.com/terror/index.htm  . Who
wrote this manual? Interesting that the Chechen terrorists in the Moscow theater left
suicide notes in their apartments. Who paid their rent?
nonpositivism: Franz: avoidance of terror/violence in public places against a Civilian
Population is the correct and laudable goal. But right now you are largely correct as to
its wobbling.
nonpositivism: But Jutta this is not deliberate disinformation given to the American public.
Not generally.

carlzim: Weapons of Mass DistrAction, Franz.
jurgen784: Hello Jutta, Franz and Carl.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl - Al Qaeda Manual´s author: Tom Ridge.
carlzim: Hi, Jurgen.
nonpositivism: Some of it is honest misinformation. But some of it simply reflects vague
 or diffuse warnings about  which reliability is uncertain. Don't blame the messenger for
everything.
juttafranz: Jutta, you mean, from drug weapons, that cause delirium, ex-stacy, now they
apply info weapons, alertness, to "inform", to lull the world into infinite justice.
juttafranz: Juergen, what next in Venezuela.
juttafranz: What do the Venezuelans expect, await?
nonpositivism: Iris....we know ur eavesdropping in on this.........do you have any words of
wisdom, any insights for us as we march through this trialogic continuum?
carlzim: Excerpt from Bzerzinski interview:  Bz: What is most important to the history of the
world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the
liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?
juttafranz: Yes, Iris, a penny for your thoughts!!
jutta_schmitt2002: We´ve been sufficiently traumatized by the Venezuelan
commercial media and keep witnessing their daily engaging in psychowarfare as
to be able to assume the "innocence of the messenger", no matter where on the
planet, Scott. There may be ignorant parts or individuals of the disinformation and
psycho-conditioning chain somewhere in the lower levels, but not so on the management
and decision making level.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl overboard.
jutta_schmitt2002: (courtesy remote diagnosing device JS PFS-ARP)
juttafranz: I invited him.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl´s back.
nonpositivism: Yes, Carl that was Zbig's "justification" for the US invasion of Afghanistan
 in 1978.......which he is proud to say correctly anticipated a Soviet counter-invasion. As for
 the maniacs it unleashed into power, he has no apology.
carlzim: Excerpt from Bzerzinski interview: Bz: What is most important to the history of the
world? The Taliban or the collapse of the Soviet empire? Some stirred-up Moslems or the
liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?
nonpositivism: Yes, Carl that was Zbig's "justification" for the US invasion of Afghanistan in
1978.......which he is proud to say correctly anticipated a Soviet counter-invasion. As for
the maniacs it unleashed into power, he has no apology.
nonpositivism: bin-Laden included.
juttafranz: Interesting, Carl.
carlzim: Q: Some stirred-up Moslems? But it has been said and repeated Islamic
fundamentalism represents a world menace today. Bz: Nonsense! It is said that the
West had a global policy in regard to Islam. That is stupid. There isn't a global Islam.
Look at Islam in a rational manner and without demagoguery or emotion. It is the
leading religion of the world with 1.5 billion followers. But what is there in common
among Saudi Arabian fundamentalism, moderate Morocco, Pakistan militarism,
Egyptian pro-Western or Central Asian secularism? Nothing more than what unites the
Christian countries.
jurgen784: Franz, this is the price they have to pay for living in America, that they have
to carry with this alert cup.
juttafranz: Save the chat folks!
carlzim: Jurgen, police carrying machine guns in New York City.
nonpositivism: Jutta, in regard to your previous remark never overestimate the
intelligent coordination of authority. Especially in the USA. It is far more diffuse,
confused and multifaceted than you will concede. This becomes crystal clear when
you work in Media, Govt. or Publishing.
juttafranz: Well, Juergen, this "cup" will also bypass, surpass them.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl, do you think the "Zbig Principle" is being revived today,
 with regard to the proclaimed "war on terrorism"?
carlzim: The kopf will bypass the dumbkopf.
juttafranz: But, Juergen, are the "escualidos", the opposition in Venezuela,
defeated forever, or are they cooking another coup?
nonpositivism: More monolithic coordination is far easier and more understandable
in Latin America. This comes out of the Paramilitary govt. tradition, smaller and
more ethnically homogeneous demographic, etc.
juttafranz: If so, what next, how many options remain?
carlzim: Jutta, the war on terrorism started with Brzig in 1970's.
carlzim: Zbig. 
jutta_schmitt2002: I think you need a heck of a monolithic coordination to do away
with the American Constitution and the famous, sacred Civil Rights in barely three
 years, Scott, without much of a protest of the defenders and lovers of democracy.

nonpositivism: I like Brzig better, Carl. Better fits the part.:))
juttafranz: Killing bolivarian top leaders, unleashing civil war, inviting the Marines,
Desert Rats and Green Berets to invade, to make drug inspections, to occupy
Venezuela, the oil fields and its potable water? What do you think, Juergen? 
nonpositivism: Jutta I have been over this with you before. You are mistaken about
dissent and Civil Liberties in the USA right now. In fact, it's still more open here than it
was during much of the Cold War and the era of Hoover.
nonpositivism: Much more so. Chomsky in those times could easily have been jailed for
"conspiracy", etc.
nonpositivism: Or at least fired from his post, even with tenure.
nonpositivism: What has happened is that dissent and technical freedom of speech
are allowed just enough to legitimate the republic.
nonpositivism: The forces in power are confident enough that the Marketplace will
control ideas and speech.
nonpositivism: Put bluntly, are you about to buy Fox or CNN so we can hear your views -
and those of Franz - 24 hours/day?
juttafranz: Scott, the Americans have a certain mentality, they do not have the dissent
syndrome, I agree, also they are civil, civilized, respecting human liberties, they believe in
a Cold War, never in an internal or external Hot War, not even in a Space Military Hot
War, between the USA and Soviet Russia, already during the fifties, sixties and seventies.

jutta_schmitt2002: But, is this really a consolation, Scott? What about the prospect of
being jailed in the near future for privately expressing ones thoughts via the internet,
or revealing them in public and private libraries where Total Awareness Enforcement
Authorities can collect data about the customers' and visitors' lecture preferences, and,
at any given moment and if convenient, determine them "belonging to a political dangerous"
 or "terrorist" group and jail them?
nonpositivism: Well, Franz they certainly do not have your sharp sense of humor!
juttafranz: Yes, that Market Place of gossip, conspiracies, lies, manipulation, etc., is stable,
Scott, it got all horses into the stable already.
carlzim: IMHO, the Cuban Missile Crisis (1962) set the stage for Soviet/Afghan conflict
and war on terror globalization & breakup of Soviet Union (SU). I offer a different
perspective on the Cuban Missile Crisis. IMHO, it was a diversion by the USA and
USSR for some political & economic power sharing. I think Castro was put in power by
and working with USA all along mainly for the following reasons:
carlzim: 1) to move the Cuban upper and middle class to Miami, and prevent the
development of labor unions to allow the lower class to work in the nickel refineries,
and sugar & tobacco plantations at substandard wages. These products are sold at low
prices (advantage for buyer) and have brought in millions of dollars to Castro. 2) to
manipulate the former Soviet Union (SU) to extend its boundaries to the Western
hemisphere and help hasten the end of Communism in SU.

nonpositivism: Jutta I do believe that if Bush and his cronies tried to implement
anything like what you describe there would be a flurry of protest and possibly even
 impeachment. There's more latent dissent and resistance to this kind of thing than
you understand. America could go through pretty serious internal convulsions.
Americans will not crown a new Monarchy or Duce here. Freedom is preferred, very
deeply over Fascism. If Bush goes too far, the counterreaction will be swift and
 strong from everyone: street people, intellectuals, the press, even Congress.
nonpositivism: Right now he is "testing" how far he can go.
juttafranz: Juergen, still awaiting your ideas about the future of Venezuela!!
jurgen784: Franz, I think Chávez will have to apply the dialectic way, for looking for
a consensus if he wants to maintain himself in power. If he does not do so, he will loose
the next election, meanwhile the Venezuelans will be awaiting this day.
nonpositivism: As a telltale sign Jutta, check out the anti-War resolution recently
passed by the City of Chicago, a city infamous Mayor Daley Sr., its conservatism
and patriotism, etc.
juttafranz: Scott, scientifically, philosophically, historically, you really confirm
the following? "America could go through pretty serious internal convulsions.
Americans will not crown a new Monarchy or Duce here. Freedom is preferred,
very deeply over Fascism. If Bush goes too far, the counterreaction will be swift
and strong from everyone: street people, intellectuals, the press, even Congress."
nonpositivism: Right now he is "testing" how far he can go."
nonpositivism: Franz, you know I do not believe that History is a science. That's
where we part company. It's all a guess. Your best guess vs. mine, haha.:>
juttafranz: Please, think twice, and give me your true opinion, Scott.
jutta_schmitt2002: So, Scott, in other words, with the mere de facto (and de jure -
USA Patriot Act) abolition of civil rights as anchored in the American Constitution
Bush has not gone already far enough as to merit a "swift and strong counterreaction"?
What does this administration really have to do, to earn a materialized reaction from the
American population?

nonpositivism: Jutta, the USA Patriot Act- which I have read in some detail - did not
quite do what you say. Not even close, although it was a serious step in the wrong
direction.
juttafranz: Elections? Juergen. These do not even exist in the USA anymore, electronically,
the very bosses of the voting machines themselves go for elections.

juttafranz: Now, will you produce an election machine that would turn you out as the loser?  
jutta_schmitt2002: If already formally, "steps into the wrong direction" have been
taken, I do not want to picture the "informal", de facto side, Scott.
carlzim: And cultures? Do they exist?Where is it easier to preserve one's own
cultural identity--In a homogeneous country like France and Germany, or a
heterogeneous country, e.g., USA and Russia?
carlzim: I think the relative ease of preserving one's own cultural identity depends
on the country's orientation, not whether it's hetero- or homo-geneous. For example,
in USA,. Jews, Poles etc., can assume dual identities:, i.e., both keep  their original identity:
http://www.gerardedery.com/sons.html  and blend into the composite American culture
like a "juggling" act. In Russia, they cannot be both Jews, Poles or Tartars and also
Russians.
In homogeneous countries, such as France & Germany,  they have no choice but to keep
their original identity. Intermarriage, however, complicates the situation.
nonpositivism: Jutta I suggest to you that support for Bush is very "soft" at best now.
There's not much margin for error. If heaven forbid there is some kind of rise in terrorism
associated with his war-mongering, he oversteps his credibility with Congress or the media,
the economy languishes, etc. he will face an enormous, inescapable credibility gap which is
building steadily. The public could run out of patience with him very, very quickly.

juttafranz: What is on the order of the day is no more elections, Juergen, only Darwinian
selections: the fittest, the Americans, will survive!!
carlzim: Comment, please.
nonpositivism: Americans can be notoriously pushy and impatient.:>
carlzim: Scott, unfortunately our opposition is weak.
carlzim: No Henry Wallace or Wendell Wilkee.

juttafranz: Why do you think that smoking is forbidden in New York, Juergen,
and flex appeal is being imtroduced, fitness, so that you, Chávez and I could vanish from
 the globe?

jutta_schmitt2002: On culture, Carl: the militarization of all spheres of society and the
"fascization" of the "patriotic hearts and minds" will prevail over cultural identities.
Don´t forget: "In times of war, we´ll do away with all our differences" - be they of
a political or of a cultural nature - and stand united against the pointed-out enemy.
nonpositivism: Carl, on ur issue of identity the case of Canada is several levels beyond
even what we have in the States. Perhaps the most omnicultural country in the world,
officially embracing it. Canadian identity is *secondary* to ethnic identity, but Canadians
still have great civility and a loose pride in their Canadian-ness.
carlzim: Agreed, Scott.
nonpositivism: Therefore in Canada I am a Jew first, a Canadian second. And this is
considered the "norm". A hundred other nationalities think the same way. It's reversed
in the USA.
carlzim: Jutta, Kulturkampf=globalization.
jutta_schmitt2002: In a military suit, all cultures look the same.
juttafranz: What will happen next? Creating sound bodies, UN-war-soldiers,
a Robocop, a Schwarzenegger, with electro-magnetic, scalar sound waves, sound
"minds", to occupy Third World Oil?
carlzim: I think the relative ease of preserving one's own cultural identity depends
on the country's orientation, not whether it's hetero- or homo-geneous. For example,
in USA,. Jews, Poles etc., can assume dual identities:, i.e., both keep  their original identity:
http://www.gerardedery.com/sons.html and blend into the composite American culture like
 a "juggling" act. In Russia, they cannot be both Jews, Poles or Tartars and also Russians.
In homogeneous countries, such as France & Germany,  they have no choice but to keep
their original identity. Intermarriage, however, complicates the situation.

nonpositivism: It's also one reason (of many) why Canadians are less likely to have
a more monolithic warlike response to aggression than we are having right now.
juttafranz: That´s the line on which we have to see the future, Juergen.
carlzim: Makes sense, Scott.
jutta_schmitt2002: Carl, in military array, all cultures look the same.
nonpositivism: Jutta, what does that remark mean?
jutta_schmitt2002: What "good" are the cultural differences and/or cultural identities if,
 in the end, they all go to war alike, nevemind how "critical", "special", "peace loving",
"reasoning" and "humanistic" they may be? What is, in this context, their significance?
nonpositivism: But Jutta some cultures are less inclined to warfare than others, would
you not agree?
carlzim: IMHO, the USA will use scalar weapons (see article below), quickly immobilizing
Iraqi defenses. I think testing these weapons has produced frequent earthquakes and
weather storms in recent years. Also, the Columbia shuttle either fired this weapon at
a test site on Earth and it failed, destroying the shuttle, or the shuttle tested a shield
against a scalar weapon fired at it from Earth, and the shield failed. Regardless, a scalar
 weapon will be up & running in time for the USA/Iraq war. Since Bearden is an ex-CIA guy,
he won't reveal everything. IMHO, USA doesn't need Russia's permission  to use scalar
weapons. Development of these weapons had been a joint USA/Russia effort because
USA has enough money, and Russia doesn't.
juttafranz: Jutta, are there no social, scientific differentiations anymore; are we living
in a classless society, in communism? There are now only Americans, Canadians, nothing
else? Do we have no class conscious anymore? Just an American, Canadian mentality?
Iris, what do you think? Is social class analysis obsolete, valueless "Marxism"?
carlzim: Part 1, by Bill Morgan // Source material: Scientist Tom Bearden,
Cheniere.Org //    Scalar Potential Interferometers "Tesla Howitzers". With the
Bush people rushing us toward war it is important for everyone to realize the true
and rather frightening possibility that this war will involve the use of scalar
electromagnetic weapons, by any of a number of possessors of such weapons.
They are called "Longitudinal Wave Interferometers," or "Tesla howitzers",
and use longitudinal (LW) electromagnetic (EM) waves…
jutta_schmitt2002: It is not a matter of inclination towards warfare, Scott. It is a matter
of how the system in its entirety "works" - in the very sense of the word. War is just the
reverse expression of production - the very means of production and the very means of
destruction are the two sides of the same labour system, of destruction of nature by society,
of exploitation of man by man, of political oppression, social discrimination and human
alienation.

carlzim: From a German contact: Very interesting I must say, this Scalar Electromag shift.
My understand is, the machine is capable of being built into the nose section of both of the
cruise missile now in production. My understanding is, it has be ability to transmitter enough
electrical power to more the fry out the electronics of present shielded equipment at great
range. If so, the cruise missile would have only be launched in short notice in advance of
standard aircraft and land equipment. This would in affect, disable all radar and
communication equipment withen a circle of what, 30 km?

juttafranz: Do we just have an agglomeration, a uniform mass of people, who all think
 alike, are equal, enjoy equality, or could some also dissent, protest against aggression,
against their own neo-nazis, the American aggressors?
jurgen784: You know, Franz, where there are oil fields, everything is possible, and there is
a lot of corruption, and the corruption is such, that nations even will be invaded for energy
reasons. The amazing thing is, that Venezuela has the oil, but does not win the war. The war
is won by those who control the oil, like happened in World War I and II.
carlzim: What is this super bomb though? My understanding is, it is very much larger the
 conventional bomb the American forces used in Vietnam for clearing jungle. apparently, it is
so large, the heat transfer when detonated, rises as of a nuclear discharge. Mr. Tom
Bearden, thought that name was familar from some where.
http://www.hsv.com/writers/bearden/tommenu.htm
carlzim: Jurgen, Venezuela doesn't own its oil.
nonpositivism: Folks sorry is enjoyable as always...but I must attend to urgent
 business matters. I will leave window open and record all, but may not be back for
awhile. Bye for now!
carlzim: From the German contact: Information of today is so neat, a double click
here and a double click there, and voila, it is done. Some years behind, this I would
 rather not admit, it was a little costly and a certain amount of risk, to gather this amount
of information in short order. Now, lightening quick, we have it.
jutta_schmitt2002: Bye for now, Scott. Sorry to see you leave. -- Franz, of course we have
 class differentiations in society, all over the "nations" of the planet. In times of war,
however, the national and international propaganda machines of the ruling elites, in a
classical, fascist move, intend to blurr all what is left of a social class consciousness to
avoid the ticking social time bomb to explode into their very faces.
carlzim: OK, Scott. I enjoyed your participation. Regards to your family.
juttafranz: Agreed, Juergen. Venezuela´s oil is a curse in disguise. And, oil is only of
value on the market. You cannot exploit oil, live by oil, nd be an emancipator at the
same time. Oil determines your existence, your dependence, the limits of your mode
of thought and living. Free Testa Energy, Reich´s Orgone, will determine other ways
and means of being, existence and transcendence. Oil is Venezuela´s problem, her
hangman´s noose.

carlzim: From German contact: Some years back while doing my first duty in Namibia
 during the Angola civil war. I was a case officer for two boer and one aborigine bush
man. The Cubans were playing hell with the area under the tutelage of the Russians.
They were killing people as if just a game. I lost my two Boer Afrikaner fellows, they
died for no good reason. The aborigine, simply save his life by going as a tracker for
the Cubans.
juttafranz: So, just imagine what PDVSA in the final analysis will mean to Venezuela.
carlzim: It is a guilt, that I have never ever have gotten over, all for no good reason
and for just a few scraps of useless information that in time was common knowledge.
 yes, today, a few clicks on the internet of public information, and voila, we have the
world.
And even today, I have a hatred for damn lions.
juttafranz: Marvellous, Carl. Exotic! I feel like going on Cyber Safari!!
carlzim: Please expand on PDVSA, Franz.
carlzim: Thanks, Franz.

jutta_schmitt2002: Franz, Iris adds, that the classical, marxist class analysis was
focused in the first place on the predominantly physical labour - exploiting capitalist
system, and on the directly productive kind of surplus value production. His class
analysis would have to be amplified, modified and even transcended according to
the shift towards intellectual labour we are experiencing nowadays.

juttafranz: Carl, for a century, Venezuela was dependent on oil for her very existence.
Now the gas of the New World Order is running out. All over electro-magnetism and scalar
weapons flash. Within a few decades, Venezuela´s water will be more precious than her oil.
 So, rather, Venezuela should really privatize, own, her water, her Malariology, her Aguas
de Mérida.

juttafranz: Thales was right: hydor men ariston: Water is the Best!
carlzim: Good point, Franz. Why doesn't Venezuela do this now?
jurgen784: Franz, I meant elections in Venezuela as established in the constitution.
jutta_schmitt2002: You mean Venezuela should keep her water NATIONALIZED,
Franz, not privatized.

juttafranz: Simply because they need cash, foreign exchange, and because a barrel of water
did not yet reach $US 666 a barrel, which is coming soon.
jutta_schmitt2002: Jürgen, ¿do you think the "opposition" has given up on their goal to
VIOLENTLY overthrow the government of Chávez, or do they have another carta debajo
de la manga?
juttafranz: Carl, perhaps beam, photon weapons will make the Rockies tumble, will
cause Gibraltar to fall, melting them into water for the Americans and Europeans.
I can imagine how that water would taste -- like Socrates´ hemlock, hamlet, it will be, to be or
not to be!!

jutta_schmitt2002: Franz ...... 4.00 o´clock .....
juttafranz: Anyhow, leaving the hemlock aside, Juergen, what do you think about the
future of PDVSA?
carlzim: How to prepare for a terror attack--From an American contact:
(1)We watched a TV program last night on how to best protect ourselves here in
America, from a biological attack.  Consensus was to prepare a sealed room, i.e.,
using plastic and duct tape.  Really, give me a break!  How long would the oxygen
 last in such an enclosure.  IMHO, why not first prepare as you would for a hurricane,
i.e., stock up on canned (non-perishable) food supplies, water, necessities like baby
formula (if youngster in home), flashlights and battery operated radios (with plenty of
batteries)...after all, there probably won't be any electricity and running water. If possible,
devise a plan for keeping in touch with relatives.
carlzim: (2)My philosophy is: If it isn't broke, don't fix it. Simplistic, yes!  But who are we

 protecting ourselves from?  Osama, Saddam, North Korea, who?  IMHO, we do not really
know who caused the 9/11 attack on U.S. (3)What, precisely, is the official duties of our (or
any nation's) military?  My simplistic thinking had always been:  To defend and protect our
 homeland.  Not go out and wage war on who we think it 'might' be.
carlzim: To protect ourselves when all else fails: "go to the center of your home (preferably
underground), take a Bible, a gun, and a bottle of really good whisky, and use them in the
order you think most appropriate."
carlzim: I'm certainly not making "Light" of this subject.  To me, an American living in the
U.S., I'm just as concerned as the next person.  But when real fear/tragedy strikes us, do
not go off half-cocked and make 'unreasonable' preparations.  The stores are now getting
rich selling plastic, wood panels, duct tape and everything else.  And also, "while 'our troops'
are 'over there' (wherever 'over there' is), who is going to defend our home front.  After
Osama, Saddam are 'gone' ....there are many more to take their place.  Or do we really
plan on policing the whole planet?!  When you get right down to it, what can any individual
really do.
juttafranz: Juergen, I can only say: Jutta loves her hens, and their delicious, colesterol-free
eggs, but she never places them in all in one basket, only in PDVSA.  

juttafranz: Folks, we have to go and look for gas, for petrol -- the queues are awaiting us.
otherwise, we won´t be moving on, won´t eat. We may be offline for 48 hours, or three days,
sleeping in our car, queing here in Mérida. Thanks to the escualidos!!!
juttafranz: Thus, we´ll continue next week.
juttafranz: I have the complete chat.
juttafranz: Before 2.00 PM today, I sent you our previous chat.
juttafranz: Surely you all read it already.
juttafranz: Scott, the censorship authorities did not pass by here as yet.

jutta_schmitt2002: I almost feel sorry, Carl, to hear how far things have come on the
 psychowarfare level in America. I picture millions of parents panicking already on the
mere thought to have to convert their homes into "oxygen proof bunkers" to protect their
family and loved ones from "biochemical attacks". This is exactly the kind of fear it takes to
 manipulate people´s minds.
juttafranz: Thus, folks, let us sing the Pademonium galactic  anthem!
jutta_schmitt2002: D'accord, Franz ---- admittedly, we are quite in a hurry this afternoon.
jutta_schmitt2002: Let´s continue next Thursday, Iris sends her best regards to all and
says she´s enjoyed "eavesdropping" on this chat very much.
jutta_schmitt2002: Bye Carl, Scott, Jürgen and Franz. See you all next time.
juttafranz: Do, think, excel all of, by and for yourselves, not here, not now, but everyhere,
everynow.
juttafranz: Carl, Greetings to Fran.
juttafranz: Bye, Everybody!!!
jutta_schmitt2002: Bye all.
carlzim: Bye, Jutta. Till next time.
juttafranz: Bye!!!

 


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